Deadly Nightshade

[Ed Cryer]

Belladonna
It acquired its alter name in the middle ages, when women used it
because of how it dilates the pupils, making them more sexy.
Beautiful Lady.

Pagan.
In Latin "paganus" meant "villager" or "peasant". That's what Cicero
would have understood. But early Christians used it as a depreciatory
term for those who stuck to polytheistic or pre-Christian beliefs; the
gods of Old Rome.

Is there a technical term for this way that words mutate in meaning?
Do people know other examples?

Ed

[Stefan Ram]

Post by Ed Cryer
Is there a technical term for this way that words mutate in meaning?

In linguistics, when a word goes south and starts to bum people
out over time, that's called pejoration or semantic degradation.

[Silvano]

Post by Ed Cryer
Belladonna
It acquired its alter name in the middle ages, when women used it
because of how it dilates the pupils, making them more sexy.
Beautiful Lady.
Pagan.
In Latin "paganus" meant "villager" or "peasant". That's what Cicero
would have understood. But early Christians used it as a depreciatory
term for those who stuck to polytheistic or pre-Christian beliefs; the
gods of Old Rome.
Is there a technical term for this way that words mutate in meaning?

I don't know it, but I'm sure there is one.

Post by Ed Cryer
Do people know other examples?

Sorry, at the moment I can remember only some examples in Italian and
German.
I stopped reading sci.lang after a very short time because there was
nothing but crosspostings to AUE.

[Bertel Lund Hansen]

Post by Ed Cryer
Is there a technical term for this way that words mutate in meaning?
Do people know other examples?
Ed

You can take all the words for psychological problems or lack of
intelligence (with a vague definition).

In Danish the expression "pendulum words" are used about words who get
the opposite meaning. I don't know English examples, but a Danish
expression is "godt 100" - literally "good 100" - which means a little
more than 100. Within the last 20 years it became clear that some Danes
thought that it meant a little less than 100. So today one has to be
careful when using that expression.

[HenHanna]

Belladonna
It acquired its alter name in the middle ages, when women used it
because of how it dilates the pupils, making them more sexy.
Beautiful Lady.


Pagan.
In Latin "paganus" meant "villager" or "peasant". That's what Cicero
would have understood. But early Christians used it as a depreciatory
term for those who stuck to polytheistic or pre-Christian beliefs; the
gods of Old Rome.

Post by Bertel Lund Hansen

Post by Ed Cryer
Is there a technical term for this way that words mutate in meaning?
Do people know other examples? Ed

You can take all the words for psychological problems or lack of
intelligence (with a vague definition).
In Danish the expression "pendulum words" are used about words who get
the opposite meaning. I don't know English examples, but a Danish
expression is "godt 100" - literally "good 100" - which means a little
more than 100. Within the last 20 years it became clear that some Danes
thought that it meant a little less than 100. So today one has to be
careful when using that expression.

Girl, Nice, neat, gay, Negro, ...

it'd be Hard to find words with NO semantic shift?



the one kind of semantic shift i really enjoyed
learning about is [Grammaticization]



____________________________

Silly are the goddy tawdry maudlin for they shall christgeewhiz bow down
before him: bedead old men, priest and prester, babeling a
pitterpatternoster: no word is still the word, but, a loafward has
become lord.

Ronald Suffield, “The Tenth Beatitude”




Pejoration is the process by which a word’s meaning worsens or
degenerates, coming to represent something less favorable than it
originally did. Most of the words in Suffield’s poem have undergone
pejoration.




Word Old Meaning
affection “emotion”
deer “animal”
forest “countryside”
girl “a young person”
starve “to die”


Word Old Meaning
undertaker “entrepreneur”
doctor “teacher”


Word Old Meaning
enthusiasm “abuse”
guts (“courage”) “entrails”
pastor “shepherd”
pluck (“spirit”) “act of tugging”
queen “woman”



Word Old Meaning
crafty “strong”
cunning “knowing”
egregious “distinguished, standing out from the herd”
harlot “a boy”
notorious “famous”
obsequious “flexible”
vulgar “popular”


Word Old Meaning
counterfeit “an original”
garble “to sort out”
manufacture “to make by hand”


lusty means sex-obsessed today???

[Ruud Harmsen]

Sat, 5 Oct 2024 20:39:19 +0200: Bertel Lund Hansen

Post by Bertel Lund Hansen

Post by Ed Cryer
Is there a technical term for this way that words mutate in meaning?
Do people know other examples?
Ed

You can take all the words for psychological problems or lack of
intelligence (with a vague definition).
In Danish the expression "pendulum words" are used about words who get
the opposite meaning. I don't know English examples, but a Danish
expression is "godt 100" - literally "good 100" - which means a little
more than 100.

Goed 100, een goede 100 mensen. In Dutch too.

Post by Bertel Lund Hansen
Within the last 20 years it became clear that some Danes
thought that it meant a little less than 100. So today one has to be
careful when using that expression.

Krap 10 (Dutch), knapp 10 (German).

[Bertel Lund Hansen]

Post by Ruud Harmsen
Krap 10 (Dutch), knapp 10 (German).

Knap 10 (Danish).

[Kerr-Mudd, John]

On Sun, 6 Oct 2024 13:41:24 +0200

Post by Bertel Lund Hansen

Post by Ruud Harmsen
Krap 10 (Dutch), knapp 10 (German).

Knap 10 (Danish).

In English, we have Crap (rubbish, poo) and, rarer, Knap (to hone a flint
to a point). So no crosssover there.
10 is 'ten'. HTH.

[bertietaylor]

What's the difference between "pagan" and "heathen"?

[Steve Hayes]

Post by bertietaylor
What's the difference between "pagan" and "heathen"?

That depends on who's using the words, and for what. Context makes a
big difference.

[bertietaylor]

Post by Steve Hayes

Post by bertietaylor
What's the difference between "pagan" and "heathen"?

That depends on who's using the words, and for what. Context makes a
big difference.

Is Arindam (the greatest genius of all time and sole god among lotsa
devils) a pagan or heathen or both as per his hostiles?

We his cyberdoggies are keen to know.

Woof-woof

Bertietaylor

[Steve Hayes]

Post by bertietaylor

Post by Steve Hayes

Post by bertietaylor
What's the difference between "pagan" and "heathen"?

That depends on who's using the words, and for what. Context makes a
big difference.

Is Arindam (the greatest genius of all time and sole god among lotsa
devils) a pagan or heathen or both as per his hostiles?

Impossible to answer without a potted biography. He could be a Pathan
for all I know.

[Kerr-Mudd, John]

On Sun, 06 Oct 2024 15:23:29 +0200

Post by Steve Hayes

Post by bertietaylor

Post by Steve Hayes

Post by bertietaylor
What's the difference between "pagan" and "heathen"?

That depends on who's using the words, and for what. Context makes a
big difference.

Is Arindam (the greatest genius of all time and sole god among lotsa
devils) a pagan or heathen or both as per his hostiles?

Impossible to answer without a potted biography. He could be a Pathan
for all I know.

Seems to me be a dog worshipper.

(FU just to AUE, a place for posting anti-einstein "theories" (read
inertial mis-understandings)

[bertietaylor]

Post by Steve Hayes

Post by bertietaylor

Post by Steve Hayes

Post by bertietaylor
What's the difference between "pagan" and "heathen"?

That depends on who's using the words, and for what. Context makes a
big difference.

Is Arindam (the greatest genius of all time and sole god among lotsa
devils) a pagan or heathen or both as per his hostiles?

Impossible to answer without a potted biography. He could be a Pathan
for all I know.

Are Pathans pagan or heathen?

Arindam is a satya-yuga person. That is, he resides in the 100% good
state unlike the present general state k'li yuga which generally is less
than 25% good.

When someone has no use for evil and sin is that person a pagan or a
heathen?

Can the great theological minds of the Occident provide an answer?

[Steve Hayes]

Post by bertietaylor

Post by Steve Hayes

Post by bertietaylor

Post by Steve Hayes

Post by bertietaylor
What's the difference between "pagan" and "heathen"?

That depends on who's using the words, and for what. Context makes a
big difference.

Is Arindam (the greatest genius of all time and sole god among lotsa
devils) a pagan or heathen or both as per his hostiles?

Impossible to answer without a potted biography. He could be a Pathan
for all I know.

Are Pathans pagan or heathen?

Who's using the word?

Post by bertietaylor
Arindam is a satya-yuga person. That is, he resides in the 100% good
state unlike the present general state k'li yuga which generally is less
than 25% good.

Date & place of birth, place of upbringing, education, current
religion?

Post by bertietaylor
When someone has no use for evil and sin is that person a pagan or a
heathen?
Can the great theological minds of the Occident provide an answer?

Again, it depends on who's using the word. Some of the great
theological minds of the Occident deprecate the use of either word.

[bertietaylor]

Post by Steve Hayes

Post by bertietaylor

Post by Steve Hayes

Post by bertietaylor

Post by Steve Hayes

Post by bertietaylor
What's the difference between "pagan" and "heathen"?

That depends on who's using the words, and for what. Context makes a
big difference.

Is Arindam (the greatest genius of all time and sole god among lotsa
devils) a pagan or heathen or both as per his hostiles?

Impossible to answer without a potted biography. He could be a Pathan
for all I know.

Are Pathans pagan or heathen?

Who's using the word?

Post by bertietaylor
Arindam is a satya-yuga person. That is, he resides in the 100% good
state unlike the present general state k'li yuga which generally is less
than 25% good.

Date & place of birth, place of upbringing, education, current
religion?

Irrelevant.

Post by Steve Hayes

Post by bertietaylor
When someone has no use for evil and sin is that person a pagan or a
heathen?
Can the great theological minds of the Occident provide an answer?

Again, it depends on who's using the word. Some of the great
theological minds of the Occident deprecate the use of either word.

No great thelogical minds around, then.

[Ed Cryer]

Post by bertietaylor
What's the difference between "pagan" and "heathen"?

I've always thought Shakespeare gave a good, running description for
"heathen".


FIRST WITCH
When shall we three meet again?
In thunder, lightning, or in rain?
SECOND WITCH
When the hurly-burly’s done,
When the battle’s lost and won.
THIRD WITCH
That will be ere the set of sun.
FIRST WITCH
Where the place?
SECOND WITCH
Upon the heath. *****************
THIRD WITCH
There t

[Steve Hayes]

Post by Ed Cryer

Post by bertietaylor
What's the difference between "pagan" and "heathen"?

I've always thought Shakespeare gave a good, running description for
"heathen".
FIRST WITCH
When shall we three meet again?
In thunder, lightning, or in rain?
SECOND WITCH
When the hurly-burly’s done,
When the battle’s lost and won.
THIRD WITCH
That will be ere the set of sun.
FIRST WITCH
Where the place?
SECOND WITCH
Upon the heath. *****************
THIRD WITCH
There to meet with Macbeth.

Possibly.

As I understand it, "pagani" was Roman military slang for "civilians",
rather like the BrE usage "punters" (which in SAfE means "people who
bet, mostly on horse races").

As Fox describes it, it was adopted by Christians in the Roman empire
for non-Christians, those who had not enlisted to fight in the
spiritual battle that shaped the Christians' worldview.

Pagani, for the most part, were unbelievers *within* the Roman empire
and therefore "civilised" (one could have an interesting discussion
about the difference between "civilisation" and "urbanisation").

But in the north of Europe Christianity began to spread beyond the
pale, beyond the boundary of the shrinking Roman empire, initially
mostly among people who spoke Germanic languages, and the Germanic
term "heathen" came to be used by Christians for unbelievers who were
regarded by those living within the civilised Roman empire as
"barbarians".

As time passed, for English-speaking Christians the two terms became
synonymous. I'm not sure what happened to them among speakers of other
Germanic languages, but here we are concerned primarily with English
usage.

With the advent of modernity in Western Europe, shaped by the
Renaissance, the Reformation and the Enlightenment, the concept of
"religion" and "religions" developed --- the book to read is:

Harrison, Peter. 1990. "Religion" and the religions in the
English Enlightenment. Cambridge: Cambridge
University Press.
ISBN: 0-521-38530-X
Dewey: 291.0942
The origin of the modern idea of religion can
be traced to the Enlightenment. This study
shows how the concepts "religion" and "the
religions" arose out of controversies in 17th
& 18th-century England. The birth of "the
religions", conceived to be sets of beliefs
and practices, enabled the establishment of a
new science of religion in which the various
"religions" were studied and impartially
compared. Dr Harrison thus offers a detailed
historical picture of the emergence of
comparative religion as an academic
discipline.

And some scholars of religion developed the term "monotheism" and
began to use the term "pagan" to refer to those who did not belong to
religions they regarded as "monotheistic" -- mainly Judaism,
Christianity and Islam.

In the 19th and early 20th centuries the term "pagan" beganto be used
by and of the cultured despisers of Christianity -- secular humanists
etc. And the term "heathen" began to be used by some Christians for
the UNcultured despisers of Christianity, the hoi polloi in Great
Britain who didn't go to church because they didn't see the point.

The second half of the second half of the 20th century saw the rise of
neopaganism as a kind of post-Christian phenomenon, those who revived
or adapted some of the pre-Christian religions, or invented new ones.
For them, "pagan" became a positive term, whereas hitherto it had been
a negative term, catergorising people by the religion they *didn't*
practise, and for neopagans it came to mean a religion they *did*
practise. So "paganism" became a thing, and not the mere absence of a
thing.

This is why the meaning of words like "pagan" and "heathen" depends on
when and where they were uttered, by whom, and referring to whom or
what.

[Ed Cryer]

Post by Steve Hayes

Post by Ed Cryer

Post by bertietaylor
What's the difference between "pagan" and "heathen"?

I've always thought Shakespeare gave a good, running description for
"heathen".
FIRST WITCH
When shall we three meet again?
In thunder, lightning, or in rain?
SECOND WITCH
When the hurly-burly’s done,
When the battle’s lost and won.
THIRD WITCH
That will be ere the set of sun.
FIRST WITCH
Where the place?
SECOND WITCH
Upon the heath. *****************
THIRD WITCH
There to meet with Macbeth.

Possibly.
As I understand it, "pagani" was Roman military slang for "civilians",
rather like the BrE usage "punters" (which in SAfE means "people who
bet, mostly on horse races").
As Fox describes it, it was adopted by Christians in the Roman empire
for non-Christians, those who had not enlisted to fight in the
spiritual battle that shaped the Christians' worldview.
Pagani, for the most part, were unbelievers *within* the Roman empire
and therefore "civilised" (one could have an interesting discussion
about the difference between "civilisation" and "urbanisation").
But in the north of Europe Christianity began to spread beyond the
pale, beyond the boundary of the shrinking Roman empire, initially
mostly among people who spoke Germanic languages, and the Germanic
term "heathen" came to be used by Christians for unbelievers who were
regarded by those living within the civilised Roman empire as
"barbarians".
As time passed, for English-speaking Christians the two terms became
synonymous. I'm not sure what happened to them among speakers of other
Germanic languages, but here we are concerned primarily with English
usage.
With the advent of modernity in Western Europe, shaped by the
Renaissance, the Reformation and the Enlightenment, the concept of
Harrison, Peter. 1990. "Religion" and the religions in the
English Enlightenment. Cambridge: Cambridge
University Press.
ISBN: 0-521-38530-X
Dewey: 291.0942
The origin of the modern idea of religion can
be traced to the Enlightenment. This study
shows how the concepts "religion" and "the
religions" arose out of controversies in 17th
& 18th-century England. The birth of "the
religions", conceived to be sets of beliefs
and practices, enabled the establishment of a
new science of religion in which the various
"religions" were studied and impartially
compared. Dr Harrison thus offers a detailed
historical picture of the emergence of
comparative religion as an academic
discipline.
And some scholars of religion developed the term "monotheism" and
began to use the term "pagan" to refer to those who did not belong to
religions they regarded as "monotheistic" -- mainly Judaism,
Christianity and Islam.
In the 19th and early 20th centuries the term "pagan" beganto be used
by and of the cultured despisers of Christianity -- secular humanists
etc. And the term "heathen" began to be used by some Christians for
the UNcultured despisers of Christianity, the hoi polloi in Great
Britain who didn't go to church because they didn't see the point.
The second half of the second half of the 20th century saw the rise of
neopaganism as a kind of post-Christian phenomenon, those who revived
or adapted some of the pre-Christian religions, or invented new ones.
For them, "pagan" became a positive term, whereas hitherto it had been
a negative term, catergorising people by the religion they *didn't*
practise, and for neopagans it came to mean a religion they *did*
practise. So "paganism" became a thing, and not the mere absence of a
thing.
This is why the meaning of words like "pagan" and "heathen" depends on
when and where they were uttered, by whom, and referring to whom or
what.

A lot of words have their fashions, like clothes or music.
"Heretic" or "Infidel" or ..... (long list omitted).
It seems we humans are excellent at finding pejorative terms for the enemy.

Another thing we do is apply tribal names to whole countries.
The Romans found a small tribe called "Graeci" and renamed the whole of
Hellas and its colonies.
Saracens were originally a small nomadic

[jerryfriedman]

On Tue, 8 Oct 2024 2:51:25 +0000, Steve Hayes wrote:

[snip interesting stuff]

Post by Steve Hayes
With the advent of modernity in Western Europe, shaped by the
Renaissance, the Reformation and the Enlightenment, the concept of
Harrison, Peter. 1990. "Religion" and the religions in the
English Enlightenment. Cambridge: Cambridge
University Press.
ISBN: 0-521-38530-X
Dewey: 291.0942
The origin of the modern idea of religion can
be traced to the Enlightenment. This study
shows how the concepts "religion" and "the
religions" arose out of controversies in 17th
& 18th-century England. The birth of "the
religions", conceived to be sets of beliefs
and practices, enabled the establishment of a
new science of religion in which the various
"religions" were studied and impartially
compared. Dr Harrison thus offers a detailed
historical picture of the emergence of
comparative religion as an academic
discipline.

..

I hope he explains why these quotations don't show
pre-Enlightenment currency of those concepts.

a1400 (a1325)
In þat siquar was in þat tun Men of alkin religioun,
Of al maner of nacioun.

("In that period there were in that town men of all kinds
of religion, of all manner of nations." I think.)

Cursor Mundi (Vespasian MS.) 18944 (Middle English
Dictionary)

c1450 (?c1400)
Leef maister, which is þe beste religioun?
translation of Honorius Augustodunensis, Elucidarium
(1909) 32 (Middle English Dictionary)

1560
They neyther allure nor compelle any man vnto their
Religion.
J. Daus, translation of J. Sleidane, Commentaries
f. xcijv

1593
The Church of Rome, they say,..did almost out of all
religions take whatsoeuer had any faire & gorgeous shew.
R. Hooker, Of Lawes of Ecclesiasticall Politie
iv. xi. 189

--
Jerry Friedman

[Christian Weisgerber]

Post by bertietaylor
What's the difference between "pagan" and "heathen"?

"Pagan" is borrowed from Latin--not from French, which has "païen"--
and "heathen" is Germanic. I can't think of any difference in
meaning. I don't think they carry different connotations, either.

If there is a difference in usage by neopagans, I wouldn't know.

The etymology of "heathen" is unclear. It could be connected to
"heath", the landscape, so it might parallel the formation of "pagan"
in some way.

Pfeifer's etymological dictionary suggests a rather fanciful origin:
A borrowing from Greek "tá éthnē" ('the peoples' > 'the heathens')
into Gothic as "haiþn-", from where it spread into West Germanic.
I have reservations. Where is the h- from? Pfeifer mentions "late
Greek aspiration". Anybody here know anything about that stage of
Greek? Does [h] just pop up there? In Wulfila's time, Gothic <ai>
was likely pronounced [ɛː], so the vowel quality matches, but why
a long vowel? This also creates an immediate problem, because Old
High German "heidan" and Old English "hǣþen" (with umlaut) point
to Germanic *[ai]. The idea seems to be that the borrowed word was
conflated with the "heath" word already in Gothic (haiþi), and then
it must have been calqued rather than borrowed into West Germanic.
It all feels strained.

[jerryfriedman]

Post by Christian Weisgerber

Post by bertietaylor
What's the difference between "pagan" and "heathen"?

"Pagan" is borrowed from Latin--not from French, which has "païen"--
and "heathen" is Germanic. I can't think of any difference in
meaning. I don't think they carry different connotations, either.
If there is a difference in usage by neopagans, I wouldn't know.

..

I believe I've heard one or two neopagans refer to
themselves as pagans, and one or two people who aren't
members of organized religions refer to themselves as
heathens.

Wikipedia says "Heathenry" is specifically Germanic
neopaganism, of which there are several varieties.

--
Jerry Friedman

[jerryfriedman]

Post by Christian Weisgerber

Post by bertietaylor
What's the difference between "pagan" and "heathen"?

"Pagan" is borrowed from Latin--not from French, which has "païen"--
and "heathen" is Germanic. I can't think of any difference in
meaning. I don't think they carry different connotations, either.

..

Pre-Christian Greek and Roman civilization can be
called "pagan" but usually not "heathen", I believe.
For instance, the adult inhabitants of Dante's Limbo
are "virtuous pagans". (That includes some Muslims.)

--
Jerry Friedman

[Steve Hayes]

Post by Ed Cryer
Belladonna
It acquired its alter name in the middle ages, when women used it
because of how it dilates the pupils, making them more sexy.
Beautiful Lady.
Pagan.
In Latin "paganus" meant "villager" or "peasant". That's what Cicero
would have understood. But early Christians used it as a depreciatory
term for those who stuck to polytheistic or pre-Christian beliefs; the
gods of Old Rome.

Pagan - origin of the term.
Source: Fox, "Christian & Pagans" 1987:30.
"In antiquity, pagans already owed a debt to Christians.
Christians first gave them their name, pagani... In everyday
use, it meant either a civilian or a rustic. Since the
sixteenth century the origin of the early Christians' usage
has been disputed, but of the two meanings, the former is the
likelier. Pagani were civilians who had not enlisted through
baptism as soldiers of Christ against the powers of Satan. By
its word for non-believers, Christian slang bore witness to
the heavenly battle which coloured Christians' view of life."

[Ross Clark]

Post by Steve Hayes

Post by Ed Cryer
Belladonna
It acquired its alter name in the middle ages, when women used it
because of how it dilates the pupils, making them more sexy.
Beautiful Lady.
Pagan.
In Latin "paganus" meant "villager" or "peasant". That's what Cicero
would have understood. But early Christians used it as a depreciatory
term for those who stuck to polytheistic or pre-Christian beliefs; the
gods of Old Rome.

Pagan - origin of the term.
Source: Fox, "Christian & Pagans" 1987:30.
"In antiquity, pagans already owed a debt to Christians.
Christians first gave them their name, pagani... In everyday
use, it meant either a civilian or a rustic. Since the
sixteenth century the origin of the early Christians' usage
has been disputed, but of the two meanings, the former is the
likelier. Pagani were civilians who had not enlisted through
baptism as soldiers of Christ against the powers of Satan. By
its word for non-believers, Christian slang bore witness to
the heavenly battle which coloured Christians' view of life."

OED's etymological note:

The semantic development of post-classical Latin paganus in the sense
‘non-Christian, heathen’ is unclear.....

There are three main explanations of the development:

(i) The older sense of classical Latin pāgānus is ‘of the country,
rustic’ (also as noun). It has been argued that the transferred use
reflects the fact that the ancient idolatry lingered on in the rural
villages and hamlets after Christianity had been generally accepted in
the towns and cities of the Roman Empire; compare Orosius Histories 1.
Prol. ‘Ex locorum agrestium compitis et pagis pagani vocantur.’

(ii) The more common meaning of classical Latin pāgānus is ‘civilian,
non-militant’ (adjective and noun). Christians called themselves mīlitēs
‘enrolled soldiers’ of Christ, members of his militant church, and
applied to non-Christians the term applied by soldiers to all who were
‘not enrolled in the army’.

(iii) The sense ‘heathen’ arose from an interpretation of paganus as
denoting a person who was outside a particular group or community, hence
‘not of the city’ or ‘rural’; compare Orosius Histories 1. Prol. ‘qui
alieni a civitate dei..pagani vocantur.’ See C. Mohrmann Vigiliae
Christianae vol. 6 (1952) 9ff.
[Thus people from outside the city -- the City of God.]

[Ed Cryer]

Post by Ross Clark
(ii) The more common meaning of classical Latin pāgānus is ‘civilian,
non-militant’ (adjective and noun). Christians called themselves mīlitēs
‘enrolled soldiers’ of Christ, members of his militant church, and
applied to non-Christians the term applied by soldiers to all who were
‘not enrolled in the army’.

No. "Milites Christi" belongs to a much later age; the Crusades.
Scour the pages of Tertullian, St Augustine, other Church Fathers, and
you won't find it commonly used, if at all. Not even after Constantine's
vi

[Ruud Harmsen]

Post by Ed Cryer
Belladonna
It acquired its alter name in the middle ages, when women used it
because of how it dilates the pupils, making them more sexy.
Beautiful Lady.
Pagan.
In Latin "paganus" meant "villager" or "peasant". That's what Cicero
would have understood. But early Christians used it as a depreciatory
term for those who stuck to polytheistic or pre-Christian beliefs; the
gods of Old Rome.
Is there a technical term for this way that words mutate in meaning?

A shift in meaning.

Post by Ed Cryer
Do people know other examples?

There are myriads. It happens all the time. Consult any etymology in
Wiktionary, for example.

[guido wugi]

Post by Ruud Harmsen

Post by Ed Cryer
Belladonna
It acquired its alter name in the middle ages, when women used it
because of how it dilates the pupils, making them more sexy.
Beautiful Lady.
Pagan.
In Latin "paganus" meant "villager" or "peasant". That's what Cicero
would have understood. But early Christians used it as a depreciatory
term for those who stuck to polytheistic or pre-Christian beliefs; the
gods of Old Rome.
Is there a technical term for this way that words mutate in meaning?

A shift in meaning.

Post by Ed Cryer
Do people know other examples?

There are myriads. It happens all the time. Consult any etymology in
Wiktionary, for example.

And across languages, ex.:

E NL D
slim slim schlimm
weird worden werden
eerie erg arg
worry wurgen würgen
clean klein klein
small smal schmal
ask eisen heischen
eventually eventueel eventuell
leap lopen laufen
spring springen springen
die doden töten
draw dragen tragen
etc enz usw

[Ruud Harmsen]

Post by guido wugi
E NL D
slim slim schlimm
weird worden werden

Quite interesting. I would never have thought that.
https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/weird#Etymology
https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/wyrd#English
https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/weorþan#Old_English

Post by guido wugi
eerie erg arg
worry wurgen würgen
clean klein klein
small smal schmal
ask eisen heischen
eventually eventueel eventuell
leap lopen laufen
spring springen springen
die doden töten
draw dragen tragen
etc enz usw

Yes.

[Christian Weisgerber]

Post by guido wugi
E NL D
weird worden werden

That is misleading. Already in Proto-Germanic the noun from which
"weird" derives was distinct from the verb that is the source of
the Dutch/German verb and OE "weorþan".

Post by guido wugi
ask eisen heischen

The German verb picked up the h- by contamination from another verb,
"heißen" (cf. OE "hātan").

Post by guido wugi
leap lopen laufen
spring springen springen

Those German verbs already vary in meaning across German dialects.
E.g., you may have heard of Amish (Pennsylvania Dutch) "rumspringe",
which literally means "running around", because in Palatinate dialect
"springe" (springen) means 'run' and "laafe" (laufen) means 'walk'.

Post by guido wugi
die doden töten

No, the English verb, likely from Old Norse, is different from the
German/Dutch one. The German cognate for "die" is OHG touwen, which
didn't survive into Modern German. Conversely, Old English "dȳdan"
is cognate with "töten". Modern English "deaden" is likely a new
formation from the adjective "dead" + "-en".

[HVS]

Post by Ed Cryer
Belladonna
It acquired its alter name in the middle ages, when women used it
because of how it dilates the pupils, making them more sexy.
Beautiful Lady.
Pagan.
In Latin "paganus" meant "villager" or "peasant". That's what
Cicero would have understood. But early Christians used it as a
depreciatory term for those who stuck to polytheistic or
pre-Christian beliefs; the gods of Old Rome.
Is there a technical term for this way that words mutate in
meaning? Do people know other examples?

There are many popular "now here's a funny thing" books out there on
etymology which cover this. A promising one (that I haven't seen) might
be "The Accidental Dictionary" by Paul Anthony Jones (2016). Examples
from that -- taken from the description on the Guardian Bookshop site
-- include "buxom used to mean obedient"; "a cloud was a rock"; "nice
meant ignorant"; "glamour was magic", and so on.

I've only read reviews rather than the book itself, but it could be
useful -- 100 words in 224 pages, which gives more breathing space than
just another "today's meaning/old meaning" list.

[pet peeve time]

Most books of this sort -- which I suspect AUE readers often find under
the Christmas tree from well-meaning family and friends -- are aimed at
the easily bored, and seldom cite sources for their statements of fact,
often skating over most of the nuance or context of a word's evolution.

Take, for example, the statement that "Buxom used to mean obedient".
It can't be faulted on accuracy, but it's only part of the story, as
the word's meaning obviously didn't just jump from "obedient" to "full-
bosomed".

It took centuries to evolve from the "obedient, pliant" meaning (which
applied equally to men and women) to the current gender-specific sense
of "full-bosomed", by way of "submissive, humble, meek", to "gracious,
courteous, affable", on to "blithe, jolly", and then to "bright,
lively" and "full of health", vigorous", eventually reaching "plump and
comely" in the late C19, and finally becoming "full-bosomed" in the
second half of the C20.

Which makes a list that says not a lot more than "Buxom used to mean
obedient" rather thin stuff.

[end of pet peeve]

[Steve Hayes]

Post by HVS
[pet peeve time]
Most books of this sort -- which I suspect AUE readers often find under
the Christmas tree from well-meaning family and friends -- are aimed at
the easily bored, and seldom cite sources for their statements of fact,
often skating over most of the nuance or context of a word's evolution.
Take, for example, the statement that "Buxom used to mean obedient".
It can't be faulted on accuracy, but it's only part of the story, as
the word's meaning obviously didn't just jump from "obedient" to "full-
bosomed".
It took centuries to evolve from the "obedient, pliant" meaning (which
applied equally to men and women) to the current gender-specific sense
of "full-bosomed", by way of "submissive, humble, meek", to "gracious,
courteous, affable", on to "blithe, jolly", and then to "bright,
lively" and "full of health", vigorous", eventually reaching "plump and
comely" in the late C19, and finally becoming "full-bosomed" in the
second half of the C20.

And "glamour" still does mean magic in some contexts, and the
"prestige" is the equivalent of the punch line in a magic trick.

[Peter Moylan]

Each time I see the Subject of this thread I'm reminded of Dudley
Nightshade, the enemy of Crusader Rabbit.